Glenn Jackson joined M&T Bank 25 years ago thanks to a development program. He’s been their chief diversity officer for an impressive five years, long before many organizations had an inkling of that role. Over the years, he’s developed an intimate knowledge of the workings of the company. But more than that, he has the trust of everyone, which has been instrumental as he transitioned to his current role in the DEI space. 

“We move at the speed of trust,” Jackson said. “So that’s been a blessing for sure. You also come up through a space where you understand where the biggest challenges are.” Because the bank started early in this and had the trust factor built in, Jackson said they’ve made great progress. 

Weaving diversity into a company must be intentional, and even though it’s still a young concept, it’s here to stay. Jackson shared his experiences during a fireside chat at From Day One’s November Virtual: Fresh Approaches to Diversity Recruiting. Lizzy McLellan Ravitch, workplace reporter at the Philadelphia Inquirer, moderated the chat. 

On average, diversity specialists have been in their roles for around 18 months, and many are new to the company they are serving, says Jackson. Which means the specialist and the company are still working through how to do what they need to do to incorporate diversity into the fabric of the organization. 

It’s no wonder that some are finding it challenging to help shift the hearts, minds and culture of companies. Can it really be done? And if changes are made, will they stick? “There’s always a fear that as you start to make progress, the commitments will start to dwindle over time,” he said.

Recently, among peers, someone asked, are you worried about people disinvesting in the work? “Probably about half the room raised their hand and said they were concerned.” Unfortunately, some businesses are making staff cuts and often less traditional roles like diversity can be in danger of not showing value. But since Jackson has been in his role for longer than most, he actually feels hopeful. And thankfully so did about a third of the peers who reported they were actually doubling down. 

“There’s an acceleration toward more challenging issues,” Jackson said. “The organization has built it in a way that is embedded in the DNA of the culture rather than built as a vertical, which, frankly, can’t possibly fundamentally change and shift the culture of an organization.”

That’s the key, isn’t it? Not to build diversity as a side gig, but as an integral part of how the company operates. Of course, it’s challenging to change mindsets and shift from traditional ways of doing things. First, you have to pay attention. Second, you have to think outside the box.

Jackson offered an example as to how they’re building DEI into the DNA. One of the most encouraging things M&T Bank is doing is partnering with CareerWise to offer an apprenticeship program. 

“It feels like a game changer for us,” Jackson said. The curriculum is for recent graduates who aren’t going to attend a university, but want a good career in banking. The program meets them where the students are, introduces them to the education they need, and combines it with the job training that will eventually lead to a good-paying job. 

“What I love about this is that you’re going right to the space that you belong,” Jackson said. The company is showing talent that it cares, and through the program they can build trust. Plus the employees coming in through nontraditional means can then become integral parts of the organization. Instead of relying on traditional methods, they went right to the source. 

Companies will continue to hire employees in the traditional way, but even those methods should be challenged and interrupted. This can be done, even at big organizations where there are typically many openings to fill. 

What hiring managers need to do is look at their biases. Most people don’t have ill intent in these roles, but unfortunately it’s natural to hire people who look like you or have experiences like yours, says Jackson.

“But oftentimes, if you just rely on that pattern, you’re going to get the same results,” he said. Diversity is gone, and a narrow perspective prevails, which doesn’t help business or customers. Rather than rely on your initial instincts, Jackson says, broaden your perspective. Create interrupters that allow people who have different experiences to show what they can do. 

If you’re not sure how to go about doing that, Jackson has some advice. “You likely already have people in the ranks right now that did not come through a traditional sense that are high performers in your organization. Go talk to them,” he said. “Then it becomes a value discussion.”

Carrie Snider is a Phoenix-based journalist and marketing copywriter.